Evolution vs. Creation

[ZanasoBayncuh]

ITT we discuss this extremely contraversial topic. Please no lameness, if you have an opinion then give reason and logic to back it up, think it out then post.

I'll start off with this: I'm an avid creationist, I enjoy this topic quite a bit, I am not easily offended in this matter. Shall we?

[Fuchikoma]

Slow gradual genenic changes over a period of millions of years makes more sense to me than a higher being creating everyone and everything in the universe.

So I go with evolution.

[SulferDragon]

I'm a Christian, creation is it. God created the world.

I mean sure evolution is a real thing, everything evolves. But for me to believe the world has been evolving for Billions of years. That's absurd! Science clearly proves the earth is NOT THAT OLD. Humans did not evolve from monkeys, or what not. Anyone who thinks that is a disgrace to the human race. (lol, rhyming)

Just my opinion, I'd type more, but far to tired :P

[Kimo]

Christian here, going with God.

Seriously, like Sulfer up there said, the Earth is not 'billions of years old', as Evolutuion would lead you to believe. The Big Bang also couldn't possibly have happened without SOME higher force involved. How in blue blazes would you be able to get BANG! THE UNIVERSE out of total nothingness? Then, of course, there are all those missing links in Evolution. Right. And I'm really a SMART MONKEY.

Come on people. If we honestly evolved from monkeys, why are they still here? If the Earth is billions of years old, why doesn't it show it? How the heck are we the EXACT PERFECT distance away from the Sun, so it doesn't torch us, while still close enough for it to give us warmth?

They call them the Darwin Awards for a reason, you know.

[kaoss]

I'm not very religious. My views are pretty humanist, but that's not the point

I believe in evolution. As Fuchikoma said, gradual change based on genetic variance and survivability makes sense to me. What doesn't make sense is, well, the "Which came first?" argument. I don't really have a set view on how it all got started. I'm open-minded to a possibly creationist view of how the world began, but as far as how we (Homo sapiens) got here, I'm in favor of evolution.

[kimcicle]

Why can't it be a mixture of both?

[Loserbait]

Agreed. Whilst I can't say I believe in a God in the traditional sense (some higher being that watches over us and who created us), I do believe in a divine power...

To be honest, I believe that when you die, your essence (or if you prefer, soul) goes back to the Earth. The only difference here is that your essence doesn't carry any memory that you will retain (Hence why everything you do here, no matter how mundane, is important in the grand scheme). And the essence from all those who die go back to the Earth in the same way. But they don't meet together into one giant soul... Rather, they are scattered and mixed around and that's what causes evolution -- different combinations/mixes of chemicals.

To that end, that divine power I spoke of earlier, it's not God. It's us. Together, each and every single living thing is a part of this greater power. It's just that this greater power doesn't have a central system.

I know it sounds very Sci-Fi (and I really dislike Sci-Fi), it's the only one that sort of makes some sense. It explains that: there IS a higher power but that it is not some person or animal that watches over us; there is life (in a sense) after death; evolution to an extent; how life can continue to exist.

And now for the insults (just try to remain calm and critical instead of destroying MY beliefs -- because, after all, I haven't criticised anyone's beliefs nor do I have the intention to. It's just that this belief works for me...).

[ZAEN]

When someone comes out and says "I'm a Christian, God created everything. Humans aren't evolved from monkies, God just went 'Click' " then tries to tell me about what science proves what, it makes me throw up in my mouth a little.

It's against my ethics to talk politics or religion with furries or idiots, so I leave you with

[nVGDlm_zk]

Originally Posted by TyTigeriku

Christian here, going with God.

Seriously, like Sulfer up there said, the Earth is not 'billions of years old', as Evolutuion would lead you to believe. The Big Bang also couldn't possibly have happened without SOME higher force involved. How in blue blazes would you be able to get BANG! THE UNIVERSE out of total nothingness?

Seems you don't know much about the Big Bang, do you?

I'm not a free thinker, but not a Christian either. Personally, I find the idea of basic organisms slowly changing to adapt to their environment more believable than us just "poofing" into existence by some higher being.

[Brett]

Originally Posted by TyTigeriku

Christian here, going with God.

Seriously, like Sulfer up there said, the Earth is not 'billions of years old', as Evolutuion would lead you to believe. The Big Bang also couldn't possibly have happened without SOME higher force involved. How in blue blazes would you be able to get BANG! THE UNIVERSE out of total nothingness? Then, of course, there are all those missing links in Evolution. Right. And I'm really a SMART MONKEY.

Come on people. If we honestly evolved from monkeys, why are they still here? If the Earth is billions of years old, why doesn't it show it? How the heck are we the EXACT PERFECT distance away from the Sun, so it doesn't torch us, while still close enough for it to give us warmth?

They call them the Darwin Awards for a reason, you know.

First off, I didn't know furries were allowed to be Christians. I would think that somehow the belief that you are actually an animal, or have the spirit of an animal would violate the whole "made in God's image" idea. And what's this about you being a "REALLY SMART MONKEY", I though you were a tiger? Did you go through some metamorphosis that we were all completely unaware of?

I also didn't know that you had a doctorate in astrophysics and have the knowledge to say that without influence from a divine power the "bang" of the big bang couldn't happen. I suppose that the biggest proponent to the big bang theory, red shift, which proves that stars are moving away from a central universal point, must be faulty, because a big bang isn't possible by your research, of which there is none. I guess that "big crunch" is also just another imaginary theory made up by crack-pot scientists that don't have a complete understanding of physics like yourself.

Another point, evolution does not say that humans came directly from monkeys. It is the belief that both species came from a predecessor species, once again which has been proven by anthropologists with the discovery of "Lucy", a dwarf homo-erectus species with a very similar skull type to humans and chimps.

Why are we in a correct distance form the Sun that allows us not to be killed from it's heat, but close enough to it that we can thrive from sunlight. Well you might have noticed 7 (well 7 now) other planets that are not the correct distance from the Sun to support the type of life we have on this planet. The lifeforms on this planet could not exist on any of the others in our solar system, but that does not rule out the possibility that other planets could have at some point in time had lifeforms. And considering the universe is a pretty big place, I'm sure that similar situations exist somewhere out there.

And what the hell do you mean by "They call then Darwin awards for a reason"? If you're implying that they're called Darwin awards because people who end up killing themselves in rather stupid and entertaining ways are as stupid as believing Darwin's theory of evolution, then you've never actually read what the Darwin awards are about. Making you a fucking idiot, but everyone who has read any of your posts prior to this would be fully aware of this. They're called the "Darwin" awards because they prove Darwin's theory of evolution by the survival of the fittest. People who removed themselves from the gene pool by their own stupidity are not able to pass on their weak DNA. You should try reading the introduction on a book sometime, they have some really useful information.

*edit* Just for record, I'm not a big believer in either creationism or evolution. I think it's pretty arrogant for a human to think that they're smart enough to have solved the entire question of existence and origin when every type of knowledge we have is really just based on something that someone else decided. Considering this entire solar system is not even a speck on the universe, I don't think that anyone could possible know for a fact how everything came into being. I think it's more important to focus on what there is to be done in one's life than where we all came from.

[ZAEN]

Originally Posted by TyTigeriku

Come on people. If we honestly evolved from monkeys, why are they still here? If the Earth is billions of years old, why doesn't it show it? How the heck are we the EXACT PERFECT distance away from the Sun, so it doesn't torch us, while still close enough for it to give us warmth.

Ok, genius, since you're rather comfortable pushing your beliefs others, I'm going to press mine. It's called Karma. You wouldn't know anything about that though, being the god fearing tool that you're ever so proud to be. Let me break it down for you. You say stupid shit, I ride your ass raw until it's no longer funny.

Now that you understand the rules of engagement

Come on people. If we honestly evolved from monkeys, why are they still here?

If the creatures in the ocean evolved from bacteria and micro-species (SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN), why are they still here?

If the Earth is billions of years old, why doesn't it show it?

Ever seen a "young" planet? It's called a FLAMING FUCKING BALL OF GAS. Ever seen what a "middle aged" planet looks like? They're covered in elemental fury the likes you cannot fathom. Tornadoes, Electric Storms, Volcanoes and Molten Rock, everywhere at all times.

How the heck are we the EXACT PERFECT distance away from the Sun, so it doesn't torch us, while still close enough for it to give us warmth.

If we didn't have a protective sphere around the planet, we would be scorched. UV rays would royally fuck up everything on the planet. Of all the planets in our solar system, we're in the middle. The medium of everything. Our planet had grounds for life to exist, so life began existing. What about the other planets? They're just there to make Earth look nice? Switch Earth with another planet, that planet would have life and we wouldn't exist.

I'm sorry, someone had something to say about science?

Do you have to hold your breathe when you talk out of your ass like that?

[Beer Can]

I love that question/argument...

How the heck are we the EXACT PERFECT distance away from the Sun, so it doesn't torch us, while still close enough for it to give us warmth?

Something about the obviousness of the answer always makes me crack up.

But as for the big bang... well, read this.
Cosmologist speaks of mind-bending dynamics behind the inflationary universe
It gives some basics.

Anyone who says that evolution is bogus is retarded. Anyone who says the earth is not a few billion years old is retarded. Zane has pretty much won this thread.

also lol furries.

[I AM THE PROPHECY.]

I've got a fairly intimidating paper to get banged out in the next two hours, but I'll be back to turn this mother out later tonight

Any other creationists who want to give me some cannon fodder, please, make yourselves known

[Ztype]

God is nothing more then something man created so we wouldn't feel so alone.

It's no coincidence that every culture in the world has believed in some form of higher power or greater cause. It's basic human nature to want to think we are a part of something greater and more important then us as individuals, rather then the horrible truth which is that we are the product of a series of random and coincidental events that occurred over a period of billions of years.

It's also human nature to try to explain things we don't understand (read: how the universe formed in it's current state) by blaming it on a higher power.

For example the ancient Greeks in all their wisdom believed echoes were the product of a demigod whose power of speech was taken away by Hera, and was only allowed the ability to repeat what others said. Obviously we now know that's not what an Echo is, but unfortunately proving how the world was created to the religious nuts is much more difficult.

Point is, if you believe it's more likely some omnipotent force created Earth and everything in it in 6 days, fashioned man from dirt and clay 5000 years ago (which fossil records and carbon dating have already proven wrong), then it is that the universe and everything in it spawned slowly over a period of 14 billion years, then you are a nut.

[dickrazor]

I can see where this thread is going...

But yes, I believe Zane has won the thread.