REVIEW: Dance Dance Revolution X US dedicab review
Posted by June.H - Wed 06/10 2009 - 01:03 AM - 3353 Views
DDR X AC shipped out this week to US arcades, our local Gameworks was lucky to get it in Monday night to set it up.
For those that aren't aware, similar to the US Supernova cabs, Betson's producing the new US DDR X cabs as well. You would think that Betson learned their lesson about developing their own cabs while cutting corners from the abyssmal quality in the Supernova prototypes. DDR X bodes a little better, but not a whole lot.
Just a few notables before I continue:
-e-Amusement system runs off the tap system rather than a card slot.
-The slots for edits are USB, not SD card slots as originally announced.
-The build of the game was 2009060301, but there wasn't anything noticeably new from the previous test build. X-Mix1 was the only long version available, On The Break was the 3rd Boss Stage, and Saber Wing was the Extra Stage. Presumably, Horatio is the Encore Extra Stage (untested).
-Dynamite Rave "Air" Special is a new version that sounds very much unlike the original. All other "Special" songs (Chaos, Freeze, Voltage, Groove, etc) seemed to be the same versions as before.
In an effort to cut costs, several cuts were made to the cabinet itself, and understandably so. The six LED light stands are gone, the LED's under the screen as well as the circle sensor are absent as well. The pads are now connected with one large metal plate rather than metal panels. The cabinet is a lot skinnier as well (although fatter due to the widescreen HD monitor). The pads also now are almost 60% thinner and lower to the ground. There is also a metal panel between the pads and the cabinet so no wiring hose to be careful for. These cosmetic changes are excusable (and I supposed neat too), but unfortunately Betson's efforts to frugal habits also makes the game suffer as well.
Just a background with me and DDR X, I've played on the US dedicab test, US upgraded location test, and the Japanese upgraded cabinets, and I've had plenty of fun AA and AAA'ing songs with relative ease. The experience of the US dedicab on the other hand completely trounces the game play compared to what I was used to. Now, I'm no super star AAA'er or quad-star player, but I've got a couple heavy AAA's under my belt on single and double so I consider myself at least a decent player. But when I'm getting B's and A's on 6-8 foot songs, there's something wrong.
Let's start with the HD lag. Yes, it was present in the previous dedicab test, but you could adjust to it since it wasn't too big. At least I could AA Saber Wing without too many problems. This is much worse. Before you ask, there's no option to adjust the timing either on the system menu either (we've checked). Did Betson even look at this game before they bothered to roll it out?
Even if you can adjust to the HD lag, the other major problem is that Betson really didn't take notes from Supernova how horrible their sensors and construction of their pads are. These arrows were stuck on, sensors that are VERY insensitive or sensors that just didn't work. I'm 170 pounds, I shouldn't have problems holding freezes while my foot is squarely and weight shifted onto that held arrow. This left lots of inconsistent game play and scoring and of course lots of room for pad perfects/goods/boos/misses/NG's, especially if you're not a heavy stepper.
Despite these enormous glaring game play obstacles, I eventually learned to adjust to the pad that was kind of working already by stepping HARD, which of course really is something one would expect from a severely aged and thoroughly played 3rd Mix with all the original factory parts and no modifications. Hardly my notion of fun. It's almost as if Betson didn't even bother doing any kind of field test or if they did, didn't bother taking any notes. I wish to have just a glimmer of hope that this is a unique case, but I doubt it.
The sound system is pretty lackluster as well. Compared to the Supernova machine that was next to it, the bass was a bit weak and speakers just didn't sound very good. That's pretty sad considering how poor Betson's Supernova sound system and construction was already.
In short, the game is fine, the new cabinet is crap. I'm rather tolerant of crappy pads (after 10 years of playing on different machines, I've learned to put up with a lot), but these are a waste of time. Inconsistent pad performance on top of the HD lag doesn't say much for design. I would get into trying to push this venue into getting e-Amusement up and running, but with a poor excuse for a working machine it wouldn't be worth anyone's time. The game is playable at best, but for serious players that are trying for score you'll find yourself all kinds of frustrated. You might be better off praying for an upgrade kit for those old DDR Extreme cabinets.
Your milage of course may vary; there are a few players that were OK with the machine and pads despite the issues.
I apologize for the poor quality pictures as I only had a cell phone camera on me.
edit; updated with another picture from -dark-xuxa.. he couldn't get any better pictures because Gameworks told him not to take any more.
Posted by Deca - Wed 06/10 2009 - 02:39 AM [ quote ]
shocking >_>
Posted by Pie-kun - Wed 06/10 2009 - 03:03 AM [ quote ]
I guess the only good thing is USB slots...Then again, they never gave us a medium in which to make edit data that we can actually export to a USB Drive.
Actually, you can play Edit Data on Asian DDR X's by just changing the file name of the file it puts on your USB drive, wonder if it would work on this.
That pad looks god awful, like some home-kit abomination.
Posted by bacon - Wed 06/10 2009 - 03:38 AM [ quote ]
since i was the one who kept saying this..
all i can say now is that its just what i was told from Konami at location tests and Betson from ASI.
eddie made probably the best point when he said that there is no way to justify us getting the same cabs as japan when the price is 20k there and only 10k here.
none of what Betson has advertised or said has indicated any sort of major redesign as this. the only thing they've hinted at was at ASI when it was said that "minor" changes would be done to the cabinet.
i just feel shitty because of how much time i've wasted covering a game that has gone in the worst direction possible..
Posted by Dan. - Wed 06/10 2009 - 06:53 AM [ quote ]
Not addressing the HD lag is inexcusable, we were all VERY vocal about this problem on the forums.
Posted by AceJay - Wed 06/10 2009 - 07:17 AM [ quote ]
Depressing as fuck, ugh.
The only plus I can see is the USB slots and the side art. What the fuck, Betson/Konami?
Posted by al2k4 - Wed 06/10 2009 - 08:51 AM [ quote ]
...I can only imagine what would happen to IIDX cabinets if they came to the US and were produced by Betsons. ~.~
Yea this is just garbage. I've played many machines over the years but it seems that this will just give me a bunch of fails. x.x
Posted by Dr.D - Wed 06/10 2009 - 11:05 AM [ quote ]
I saw this coming when they first announced any ties with betson again
Posted by jbean3535 - Wed 06/10 2009 - 11:41 AM [ quote ]
The whole thing just looks cheap
Posted by Kalek - Wed 06/10 2009 - 11:47 AM [ quote ]
just called my local gameworks (the columbus location) to see if they got one in
i was told that they have it in and they just haven't set it up yet
so, if what i was told is correct, i'll report (and i'm sure ranatalus will too) on the cabinet quality over here. hopefully this isn't the case for every cabinet, but knowing betson, it will be for most of them :/
Whether it be consumer software or arcade amusement, all Konami games worth playing are Japanese versions. Fuck American versions, they will always be total shit. Even the Chinese version of Universe 3 is better than the US version. If you want colored manuals, superior gameplay, and better button prompts, stick to Japanese versions. I made sure my MGS4 has a colored manual, which is why I own the Japanese version. Die Konami of America, please die.
Well, DDR X continues to disappoint. I'm not liking the idea of a lowered stage. The bar pads are missing too.
If they really wanted to cut costs, why have Betson make the cabinets? It's just another company they have to pay for something they already know how to do.
Did the circle wheel in the center do anything in the Japanese cabinets? I read that they do nothing.
This is very depressing news. My whole arcade crew has been ecstatic for the past few weeks due to our Gameworks getting their first new cabinet in about five years. They had the cabinet in yesterday but the techs weren't on hand to set it up, so we all had to stare in awe for a minutes in the back. This is a big letdown.
FUCK YOU BETSON. I am canceling my order with BMI right now. :(
Sad, sad day...
Woah.... hold your fuckin' horses.
This is just one review. ONE.
I think it'd be better to wait for more players to try it out... maybe even for the machines to, I dunno, break in before canceling orders and demanding refunds and whatnot? Sure there are problems listed that don't need breaking in/further testing to dislike, but there are a lot of problems listed above that do.
Whether it be consumer software or arcade amusement, all Konami games worth playing are Japanese versions. Fuck American versions, they will always be total shit. Even the Chinese version of Universe 3 is better than the US version. If you want colored manuals, superior gameplay, and better button prompts, stick to Japanese versions. I made sure my MGS4 has a colored manual, which is why I own the Japanese version. Die Konami of America, please die.
I think I'd rather pay like 20 bucks for a US version without color manuals instead of 60+ to import it with.
I think it'd be better to wait for more players to try it out... maybe even for the machines to, I dunno, break in before canceling orders and demanding refunds and whatnot? Sure there are problems listed that don't need breaking in/further testing to dislike, but there are a lot of problems listed above that do.
Betson had their shot to make a good arcade pad back when SN came out, and they fucked that up despite the fact that Roxor and people making their own pads managed to do them better than they did while paying a fraction of the price developing them. They still don't work well when it comes to holding for freeze arrows, which is like having a beatmania/IIX turntable to not continue scrolling despite you still spinning the damn thing.
Nobody in their right mind is going to shell out thousands of dollars for new pads that function mediocre at best and inoperable at worst. I say if you fuck up making something that costs thousands of dollars to buy, you don't deserve a second chance, especially if you mess that up as well. They had THREE years to correct every mistake they made with their original pads, and all they have shown is that they have learned NOTHING from their mistakes.
@Mint Mania IIDX
what does itg have to do with any of this?
@travelsonic
just by these few shots its already screamingly apparent that no thought for anything other than lowest cost possible was put into this. the top layer of the pads being all one piece alone makes this not worth buying. the sensors are most likely the same ones betson sn2 cabinets had which split apart after a month..
ugh i was considering making the drive to this gameworks considering i live about an hour and a half away from this but it seems like its not even worth it. maybe for eamuse but depending on how bad the lag/pads are idk.
For those that are blaming Konami, OK seriously read the review.
-DDR X isn't that bad, in fact I welcome the lack of bland hard charts from Supernova 2. The new charts aren't necessarily hard, but there's a fair chunk of actual fun charts. As a game, and even with the annoying announcer, it's not that bad.
-That being said, Konami isn't to blame for a crappy cabinet. The dedicab that was testing at Boomers and Hollywood Park was fine, despite the HD lag. The pads for those machine were working great, the LED's were neat, but you could do without. And Konami of America really doesn't have tons to do with this (complaining to KoA will most likely just be barking up the wrong tree).
-Enter Betson on the other hand, their pads are just straight up garbage, coupled with the HD lag just makes for a really hard game to score well on. And with the timing window being EASIER on DDR X (compared to SN2), it makes one think that they kinda suck.
Cancelling your order with Betson might not be the solution, but I'd definitely call them up to make sure if your machine doesn't work like it's supposed to, either get a return or something.
In fact, I hope Konami of Japan realizes how crappy Betson is doing and does better quality monitoring of their stuff.
And I have to agree with the ITGers, Betson needs to get some hints from Andamiro.
Bacon: It's not your fault, I'm sure the pads that Betson were showing off were probably Konami's rather than their's. I just hope the pads that are mass-produced are better than these and that what we have are just prototypes. Still, the HD lag and pushing the game out the door with such an obvious issue is simply careless of them.
Also, I'll try to sneak a video tomorrow of game play to show the lag issue. If you're listening to the music rather than watching the screen, that's a lot easier than trying to play by sight.
The thing I REALLY like from the pad is the fact that is it one smooth surface. No screws or corner brackets to get your feet caught on. Sure it is a pain in the ass to maintain, and that is indeed a serious flaw, just hated the fact that my feet got caught continually on the SN dedicabs when I never had that problem with pre-SN machines.
just called my local gameworks (the columbus location) to see if they got one in
i was told that they have it in and they just haven't set it up yet
so, if what i was told is correct, i'll report (and i'm sure ranatalus will too) on the cabinet quality over here. hopefully this isn't the case for every cabinet, but knowing betson, it will be for most of them :/
they got it in and the op pretty much describes it perfectly
If they really wanted to cut costs, why have Betson make the cabinets? It's just another company they have to pay for something they already know how to do.
Because shipping all the parts to an entire arcade machine from Japan to America is about the worst thing you can do to try to keep it cheap. Not that I condone Betson's terrible performance, but I understand why Konami does it.
...It really pisses me off that they continue having horrible step sensors. Why has nobody started using microswitches in a dance pad? It'd be so simple, so reliable, and so easy to fix, but none of the pad manufacturers have done it, instead using more expensive and less reliable custom sensors... And even worse is that they can't manage to make the pads as well as they used to. The HD lag without correction is inexcusable. All of a model of machine are built exactly the same, so having one fixed timing offset delay for them would fix it. Rock Band 2 can do it custom for each and every audio/video setup, by sensing it automatically. And Betson/Konami can't do it for their own arcade cabinet. Jeez.
I have played on a Japanese DDRX machine while I was in Fukuoka, Japan and let me tell you it was an AWESOME experience! However, seeing what they did with the US cabinets, boy what a letdown! I would rather pay $20,000 + international shipping for a good quality machine rather than $10,000 for a cheaply built localized machine.
Posted by .MeowMix. - Tue 06/16 2009 - 12:57 AM [ quote ]
At least look at a little thing to possibly brighten your day. If you use CF pads, the changed pads on the US DDRX might actually help your gameplay... then again, that doesn't change the HD lag and crappy mechanics anways I suppose.
Posted by Geochi1 - Tue 06/23 2009 - 10:05 AM [ quote ]
Sensor updates have been tested successfully, these updates will be shipped to existing locations within a few days.